Secretary of State Colin L. Powell and Canadian Minister of Foreign Affairs Bill Graham Press Availability

FOREIGN MINISTER GRAHAM: Thank you everyone for coming.

This is the opening of our press conference. I just would like as an opening statement to say I took the opportunity to welcome Secretary Powell here to Ottawa. He has been here before. In fact, he was here receiving a decoration from the Governor General some time ago. He is very familiar with Canada and with Ottawa. We are very pleased to have him back.

We are particularly pleased to have him at this particular time given I think what all Canadians would recognize would be his tremendous personal success in terms of the diplomacy at the United Nations and through all the capitals of the world in bringing us to the place where we are in terms of Iraq, of ensuring that Iraq has understood that there is a clear message from the Security Council that it must take measures to allow inspectors in and there are clear consequences if it does not.

We welcome particularly, obviously, the President of the United States' engagement with the United Nations process but also Secretary Powell's personal role in making sure that this comes to a positive fruition. We are very pleased he took the time to come and speak to us at this time.

Obviously, our meeting covered the range of Canada-U.S. relations. We spoke of our border issues. We spoke of individuals at the borders. We spoke of how we have the greatest trading relationship with one another. We also discussed world affairs. We discussed matters relating to North Korea, to the Middle East, and managed to have an opportunity to go through a full range of our concerns together.

Donc, j'aimerais juste dire un mot en français à ce que nous avons eu des conversations évidement très très fructueuse, comme entre deux amis, et M. Powell est très bienvenu à Ottawa dans les circonstances actuelles. Il vient nous dire ce que s'est passé aux États-Unis, ce qui va se passer en Iraq et la collaboration que nous aurons à nos frontières pour que les gens soient libres de transférer les frontières librement comme on a eu toujours dans le passé, entre nos deux pays.

(Official English translation)

I would like to say a few words in French, to explain that we have had, of course, a very productive discussion. We have discussed, as two friends would. Mr. Powell is fully welcome in Ottawa in the present circumstances. He has come here to describe what is happening in the USA, what will happen in Iraq. We talked about cooperation at the border, so that people could be free to cross at the border as we have done in the past.

Secretary?

SECRETARY POWELL: Merci mon ami.

FOREIGN MINISTER GRAHAM: Ah, c'est bon!

SECRETARY POWELL: That's it.

FOREIGN MINISTER GRAHAM: Oh, you told Mr. Vilta more than that.

SECRETARY POWELL: It is a great pleasure to be back in Ottawa. I have been here a number of times in the past and it is always a great pleasure to be back in Canada, our great northern partner.

Bill and I, as he just noted, had a full exchange of views in all of the international, regional and bilateral issues that are of interest to both of our nations.

There are always little problems that exist between our two nations, but they always have to be seen against the backdrop of the strength of our relationship; $1.2 to $1.4 billion worth of trade crossing that border every day; 200 million people going back and forth across that border every year.

We are joined by shared values. We are joined by something of a common history. We are joined by a solidarity that comes from standing side-by-side in times of crisis and going into battle together.

America treasures this relationship with Canada. It is a relationship that will always be strong and it is an example to the rest of the world about how two nations can get along, with a long, shared, mostly unguarded, unwatched border, which we have had to pay some attention to lately because we know that there are terrorists out there who will try to use that openness to attack either one of our two countries.

But we have shown that we can deal with this kind of change in the situation through open dialogue and on the basis of the friendship that has existed for so many years.

So, Bill, I want to thank you and your colleagues for your hospitality here today.

I especially want to thank you and the government and the people of Canada for the support you have provided to the United States during this global war against terrorism for the past 14 or so months and I look forward to our continued close cooperation to make this an even stronger relationship.

Thank you, sir.

FOREIGN MINISTER GRAHAM: Thank you very much, Colin. I appreciate that.

I think we will start with questions, then.

QUESTION: Speaking of the mostly unguarded, unwatched border, some Canadians have had some difficulty there when it was being watched and being guarded.

Mr. Graham, did you raise the case of Mr. Jalbert who is in jail in Maine? Also, another Canadian who is in custody in Guantanamo Bay, the 16-year-old Omar Khadr?

If both of you could respond generally to this whole issue about profiling and what is being done at the border to make sure that country of origin is not an automatic trigger to Canadians getting fingerprinted or photographed.

FOREIGN MINISTER GRAHAM: Right. That is a very good question.

I want to go back to Colin's opening remarks about the nature of our border and the nature of our friendship and I want to say that we are working on these issues in that spirit of cooperation and friendship of which he spoke.

The issue of NSEERS, which is the technical term for the way in which instructions were given for entry and exit permits of the United States, clearly we were very concerned with the fact that people were being picked out of lines and profiled on the basis of their place of birth.

I am very pleased to say we worked that out, as neighbors do, and we said "Look, this doesn't make sense for the two of us as countries of immigrants to chose the place where you are born, which might not even be your nationality in some respects, you just happened to be born there. How could that determine whether or not you are a terrorist?"

The United States has been very responsive on that and we have worked our way through that and we will continue to work through that.

As Colin pointed out, with the number of crossings we have and the tremendous extent of our relationship, we are bound to have individual problems. We will continue to work with those individual problems on that basis.

In terms of Mr. Jalbert, I am very pleased to say that I am informed that the prosecutor in Maine has withdrawn the appeal and therefore the matter is in the hands of the INS and we believe that the INS will shortly be able to deal with this in a way that he will be able to leave the United States and we will be able to resume.

We want to do that, because this was a case that was reflective of the types of things we can get into if there is a problem between us. I mean, that is a gas station he went into in which the exit ramp goes into Canada. That is the way Canada and the United States are, we are joined that way and we will continue to work together, the Secretary and myself and both our departments, to make sure that we resolve those types of issues.

In terms of Mr. Khadr, the Secretary has given me his personal assurance that we will have access to Mr. Khadr as quickly as is conceivably possible and we will be following that up in the weeks to come.

SECRETARY POWELL: I really have nothing to add. He gave a complete answer. We discussed both of those issues as well as -- the two individual issues -- as well as NSEERS.

The Minister and I have been in close touch for a couple of months over the NSEERS program and some of the difficulties that we encountered with the program and we have made it as simple as we can.

There are still some issues we will work on, but I can assure you we are doing everything we can so that we respect Canadian citizenship and we are not seen as profiling anyone, but doing what we believe is necessary to protect ourselves and to protect Canadian citizens. I hope that we will continue to work in the same spirit that we have been working.

FOREIGN MINISTER GRAHAM: Thank you.

QUESTION: Mr. Secretary, regarding the Iraq resolution, a number of U.S. officials, including Deputy Secretary Armitage last night, have said that operative paragraph 8 applies to the no-fly zones. Other members of the Security Council disagree.

Do you agree that it applies to the no-fly zones and would the U.S. argue that any no-fly zone violations in this period constitutes a material breach?

SECRETARY POWELL: I think what we are interested in seeing is a new spirit of cooperation, if there is going to be one, from Iraq that will allow us to get the inspectors in and for them to do their job.

When we were working on the resolution we said that Iraq should not take any action that would be a hostile act against any member state that is implementing current UN resolutions.

One could argue whether or not the no-fly zone represents all of the members of the Security Council agreeing to the no-fly zone as a way of implementing the UN resolution or just a judgment that was made by the United States and the United Kingdom.

But I think we ought to see this in terms of whether or not Iraq is intending to cooperate. If they were to take hostile acts against United States or United Kingdom aircraft patrolling in the northern and no-fly zones, then I think we would have to look at that with great seriousness if they continued to do that.

So we will be watching all of these things and making judgments as we go along.

I don't want to say here and now what we might do in the event of a particular incident, but the resolution I think is pretty straightforward and clear with respect to the spirit we hope Iraq will enter into in trying to find a peaceful way forward.

QUESTION: Mr. Powell, countries with visa waivers are being asked to update their passports if they want to go into the United States so they include biometric information. Could you tell us whether Canadians will need to have some sort of special identification in the future enhanced with biometrics?

For Mr. Graham, can you tell us or confirm to us that your department is in talks with the United States about some sort of future citizenship card enhanced with biometric information?

SECRETARY POWELL: I really can't get into the specifics or details of that because it really falls under the responsibility of the departments within our government.

What we are trying to do is to make sure we don't cut down the flow of citizens going back and forth between our two countries, while at the same time protecting both of our populations from individuals who might wish us harm.

It is not just the United States that is in the sight right now of terrorists. As you saw from this tape, which may or may not have come from Usama bin Laden but has come from someone who is threatening the civilized world again, Canada is just as vulnerable as the United States and both of us, I think, have an obligation to our citizens to do what we can to protect our citizens.

If we find that there are new methods of identification that are sensible, that do not restrict the flow of individuals going back and forth, we certainly would consider it, but only in the closest consultation with our Canadian colleagues.

FOREIGN MINISTER GRAHAM: Thank you very much.

We are very much in the same position. Obviously our passport office is always looking at ways in which we can make our passport the most efficient vehicle for Canadians to have access to anywhere they go in the world. So we are not in any way opposed to any new technology, but we would only adopt it if in fact it was in the interest of Canadians and in the interest of making our passport more secure, and our relationship.

Presently I know my colleague Denis Coderre is anxious, for example, to talk to our American colleagues about looking at our Maple Leaf Card as a way in which we could give added security to those who are landed immigrants in the country and who also go back and forth across the border. They are contributing to the economy of North America. They may not be Canadian citizens yet, but they are future Canadian citizens and I know that they make a contribution to our mutual economy.

So I think we will just continue to engage on looking at all sorts of means in which we guarantee both access and security, but also a guarantee of the personal information of the individual as well. That is the background of what we are trying to do.

I want to say, along with the Secretary, that in terms of the recent threats that we have had through the possible bin Laden -- whether it is bin Laden or not, the point of the matter is, it is a wake-up call for all of us. We saw Bali recently, we have seen what took place in Moscow. We know the types of consequences if we are not vigilant.

The Deputy Prime Minister was very strong on this yesterday. We will be vigilant. We are there to make sure that Canada is protected.

SECRETARY POWELL: I hope that all Canadians will realize that these issues we are working through with respect to visas, with respect to NSEERS, are not directed at Canada or Canadian but are a way of having a better handle and greater knowledge with respect to who is going in and out of the United States and in and out of Canada and making sure that we are protecting our people, not trying to harass our citizens but protecting our societies, protecting our people.

I hope that point will get across. I think that understanding will become clearer as we simplify the procedures and as we get rid of those that really are not serving that specific purpose for which they are intended.

QUESTION: A question for Secretary Powell.

The KEDO Executive Board is meeting in New York at this moment. I wonder if you could take the opportunity to tell us what the U.S. position is on the current shipment of oil heading to North Korea and on the subsequent shipments, which have been paid for.

Have you been able to persuade your Asian allies of your position on these shipments?

SECRETARY POWELL: We have stayed in very close touch with our Asian allies and other friends, especially in the European Union, which has an interest in KEDO. We have been able to consult widely with them, and I think we are all together on this issue.

It comes out this way.

One, North Korea has to end this program that we discovered to enrich uranium. We are all united on this prospect.

With respect to continuing to provide advantages from the Agreed Framework, such as free fuel, we believe it was appropriate and prudent to send in this shipment, which is already on the high seas and is only a few days away from docking.

That is the position we took into the KEDO meeting today, with the understanding that we cannot continue to provide fuel in this manner in light of North Korean violation of the understanding.

I hope that KEDO will agree at their meeting today that future shipments should be suspended.

QUESTION: Mr. Secretary, on Iraq, the Australians and the British have both said that if it comes to hostilities, they are in.

Did you come here seeking any commitment from Canada on diplomatic or military support in that event -- that is, unless you were perhaps asked not to ask?

SECRETARY POWELL: We did discuss Iraq, of course, in considerable detail. We are looking for a peaceful solution. That is what the resolution was all about, and that is what President Bush's speech to the UN on September 12th was all about.

I made it clear to my colleague that the United States was also prudently considering contingencies in the event the use of military force should be required. We hoped at that time that other nations would be willing to support such military effort, either under the umbrella of the UN, if the UN collectively decided to act; or if the UN decided for one reason or another not to act and the United States decided to act with like-minded nations, we would put together a strong coalition of like-minded nations. At the appropriate time we would talk to Canada about it.

I did not come with a specific request or a specific ask of Canada.

FOREIGN MINISTER GRAHAM: And I wouldn't ever think to ask the Secretary what he might want to ask when he is here, because we have that nature and that relationship that he is going to come and say what he wants to say anyway. I know that.

QUESTION: Secretary Powell, another question on the resolution.

Yesterday, Secretary Annan's comments seemed to indicate some kind of confusion over the definition of what constitutes material breach, what the threshold for violation is.

What steps going forward are you going to take to make sure that the definition that the U.S. has squares with what the other members have, and how do you resolve that if there is a conflict?

SECRETARY POWELL: As you will appreciate, this very question occupied a lot of my time and the time of my colleagues in the Security Council over the last couple of weeks.

What the resolution says is: One, Iraq has been in material breach in the past. It is in material breach in the present.

If you look at the operating paragraph number 4, it says that if they do not give us a complete accurate declaration or if there is lack of compliance with the inspectors, those facts in and of themselves constitute a material breach.

No further judgment is needed on the part of the inspection team or the Security Council. That is a material breach.

The resolution in that paragraph continues to say that if that is the case, then it will be referred immediately to the Security Council for them to make an assessment, an assessment of what the Council might choose to do.

I am sure that during that assessment they would make a judgment as to how serious it was and what action might be required of the Council to be faithful to the purpose of the resolution that Iraq should not be permitted to continue to make new material breaches which keep the inspectors from doing their job.

That certainly would be an area of considerable discussion when it occurs.

The very fact of lack of compliance or false declaration in and of themselves constitutes a material breach.

LA MODÉRATRICE: Une question en français, s'il vous plaît?

QUESTION: I could ask my question in French but Mr. Powell is going to be responding in English anyway.

The question is to Mr. Powell.

Concerning the question of the Quebecer Michel Jalbert, I think a lot of people in Canada are seeking to understand a little bit more why this happened from the U.S. Government's perspective and also to get an idea of whether this is what Canadians can now expect under the U.S. new border policies.

SECRETARY POWELL: I think it was an unfortunate incident. On two earlier occasions he came across at that point, and he was reminded that this is not the appropriate thing to do. Then on the third occasion he came across, and a weapon was located in the car. At that point the authorities believed it was appropriate to take him into custody.

We now have been able to arrange for him, with his family's assistance, to go out on bail. The prosecutor is not appealing that bail judgment. Under our law he then became the responsibility of the INS. As you heard the Minister say a few moments ago, we have been expediting the case and we hope that in the very near future, in the next day or so, the INS will complete their work and return him to his family.

No, I don't expect it to be a problem in the future or a pattern. It was a unique case among the 200 million back and forth every year where in this instance, if it had not been for that third effort, it might not have happened.

It is not any kind of pattern, and I don't expect it to be any kind of recurring problem.

THE MODERATOR: The last question, microphone 6.

QUESTION: For both Mr. Secretary and Mr. Minister, I am going to go back to Secretary General Annan's comments again.

Another thing that he said was that he wanted the U.S. to be a bit more patient than he senses they are at the moment. Even if you get past defining what is a material breach, he was saying even at that point, I am asking patience of the U.S. Government.

Can you reassure him, Secretary Powell, that the United States is going to perhaps not jump at the first possibility of defining something as a material breach?

And to Foreign Minister Graham, is Canada comfortable with the pace at which the U.S. seems ready to proceed in the case of a breach?

SECRETARY POWELL: I think the United States has demonstrated considerable patience over the last two months since President Bush gave his speech at the United Nations. We worked with all of our colleagues in the Security Council. We came up with a strong resolution. We worked closely with Secretary General Annan. That patience will continue.

At the same time, I think it is absolutely necessary that there be no confusion, no misunderstanding that if the Iraqis do not cooperate, do not comply, do not work with the inspectors, do not take this opportunity to get rid of their weapons of mass destruction, then there will be consequences. And those consequences will involve the use of military force to disarm them through changing the regime.

I think it is important that there be no misunderstanding about this and we keep the pressure on.

Everything we have seen the Iraqis do since the 12th of September, the phoney invitation for inspectors to come back in the next Monday and then backtracking on that two days later, and the negotiation they tried to conduct with Mr. Blix as to what he could or could not do, all of that suggests that the only thing the Iraqis will respond to is pressure. That pressure has to be kept on.

I understand the Secretary General's desire to give this process time. The United States understands that. But we don't want there to be any confusion that he is somehow being given slack or he gets a couple of free passes before serious consequences are on the table.

That would not help us in our effort to disarm this regime, for him to believe that he can once again deceive, distract and throw us off the scent. This time he must come clean. He must be disarmed. And he will be disarmed one way or the other.

FOREIGN MINISTER GRAHAM: If I could follow up on the Secretary's observations, Canada's position has always been in strong support of the United States' position for a strong resolution with clear consequences, because we have always said that we believe that that was the best way to avoid a conflict in the region, for the reasons that the Secretary so explicitly set out.

We don't have any illusions about Saddam Hussein. We know what his background is.

I personally met with Dr. Blix. Obviously the Secretary has regularly. He is going to put in an inspection system which will be impeccable in its way and is going to have world support to it.

If he comes back and informs the Security Council that there are things going on there, that he is not getting full access -- while there may be an anxiety in the world to avoid what were called hidden triggers in the original resolution or the idea that one party would act precipitously, I think if you look at what the United States has done, particularly under the guidance of the Secretary, how the United States has come to the UN, has worked through a very difficult, complex negotiating diplomatic situation to get us where we are with a clear resolution, with the support unanimously of the Security Council, I am convinced there are violations in Iraq that the Security Council itself is engaged now and will be obliged morally to take the steps necessary to enforce that.

So there may always be small matters of days, but I think the world community is now saying we have the opportunity in hand in a unanimous resolution which has the backing of everyone to make sure that Iraq conforms and that we have a way to deal with this without having to go to conflict.

Now the ball is very much in Iraq's court.

So I don't see the problem really arising the way you frame it. I think what will happen is Iraq will conform. I think its neighbors are now putting pressure on it to say: Look, there is no other alternative.

And it is very much thanks to the role of the United States that we have the pressure there to make sure that this happens.

Thank you.

THE MODERATOR: Thank you. Merci à tous.

QUESTION: (In French)

FOREIGN MINISTER GRAHAM: (In French) As I just told the Secretary of State, we have a border with millions of people every year crossing the border. It is a complex and huge system. There will always be specific individual cases. I have always been firm. I have always protected the interests of Canadians, regardless of where they are from, regardless of their religion, their place of birth. We have managed to solve the problem of the country of birth. Now, we are going to find a way to have the greatest possible flexibility for people who enter the U.S. (inaudible) and for security for Americans, too. But the best way to avoid problems for individual Canadians who cross the border, the best way is cooperation between Canada and the U.S. We have to cooperate. That is the symbol of this visit here today. Mr. Powell has come here to work and cooperate with us. There will be problems but they can be settled in the spirit of friendship and cooperation as we have always done.

[End]

Released on November 14, 2002